Phillyist: Philly Crime Rate Affects Penn Students

notjoe

Wed, 23 Nov 2005 11:32:49 -0500

It's Terrell Pough -- obviously you guys really care about him.

Mike VanHelder

Tue, 22 Nov 2005 12:19:34 -0500

C'mon, Nicole. You don't think that ultra-small guns for the fashionably conscious don't exist already? Now it's just a question of marketing them to a new audience: College kids!

Nicole

Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:52:36 -0500

I suddenly have visions of some enterprising young Penn Republican starting his or her own line of specially designed teeny tiny guns.

PLD

Mon, 21 Nov 2005 17:40:35 -0500

But the handbags are too small, jeans too tight and what college kid wears a jacket in the winter? Those Pennies will never go for it.

Nicole

Mon, 21 Nov 2005 13:19:02 -0500

I agree 100% with Steve - incentive programs to get guns off the street are a good idea, and strictly enforcing laws that get guns off the street are key. And Mike, I can't tell you how much I agree that a gun safety course should be a requirement for owning [I know you're talking about a permit for concealed weapons, specifically...but I think it's a good idea to really know guns inside and out if you're going to own one]. I have no desire to own a gun, but I took a hunter's safety course and I've also been to the shooting range many times just so I know how to operate a gun safely if need be. That may seem like overkill since I don't ever plan to own a gun, but I sort of like to be prepared.

Mike VanHelder

Mon, 21 Nov 2005 12:45:06 -0500

Any private establishment has the right to ban firearms from their property, sure. And I agree that taking a proper self-defense course does wonders for how you can handle a mugging (disclosure: I taught martial arts and self-defense for several years). But I also think that people really underestimate the personal safety implications of safe, legal gun ownership. As much of a gonzo gun-rights advocate as I am (ask me about the Brady Bill someday!), I do agree that it may not be a bad idea for Pennsylvania to make a gun-safety and marksmaship test a condition of getting CCW permit. But then I hardly think that the gun-ownership debate is going to be solved in the comments section of Phillyist. =)

steve

Mon, 21 Nov 2005 12:42:30 -0500

I think the idea should be LESS GUNS, more GUN CONTROL and more programs to get guns off the streets -- I know in New York they'd give you money if you turned in a gun, no questions asked. We need a similar program in philadelphia. You should be able to walk around your neighborhood at any time of night. West Philly can be a little intimidating at times but it's a joke compared to places like Gray's Ferry, North Philadelphia, Kensington, etc. So count your blessings Penn students, you're still living in a bubble of over protective, gentrifying uPenn.

Nicole

Mon, 21 Nov 2005 12:18:19 -0500

Personally, I think we're both giving criminals too much credit -- I get the idea that they don't think too hard about the consequences of their actions. Most criminals are just not that smart. Otherwise, they'd be doing something more productive than holding up Penn students, right? I'm not fundamentally against gun ownership or anything, but I do think Penn and Temple and any other college campus have the right to ban concealed weapons on campus. It's just asking for trouble to let people who are doing a lot of drinking and drugs and getting over-emotional because of stress have access to guns, especially because you know that people who are not used to handling firearms would be carrying. I was mugged my freshman year of college on Temple campus - some douchebag held a knife to my throat and threatened to kill me if the person I was with didn't give him his money. Having a gun wouldn't have made the situation better somehow and might have made it worse. I took self-defense classes afterward and I can say with certainty that it would have made a huge difference in how the attack played out.

Mike VanHelder

Mon, 21 Nov 2005 11:24:36 -0500

Perhaps the knowledge that that Penn student might be packing might deter violent muggers, and perhaps allowing students to exercise their constitutional and state- and county- sanctioned rights to carry a gun might not be a bad idea either. Those civil liberties are so pesky, aren't they?